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Re: Fleeting/Random/Thoughts

Posted: 22 Oct 2018, 11:10
by storm84
Coming into work sick is the ultimate dick move. Bringing a sick kid in is on a par with that. No worker is so important that they can risk others getting sick.

Re: Fleeting/Random/Thoughts

Posted: 22 Oct 2018, 12:07
by Mugsy
Agree Cherry and Storm. It's why I went back to being a public servant. The culture around not working when sick is a lot better than my experience with the private sector.

Re: Fleeting/Random/Thoughts

Posted: 22 Oct 2018, 12:12
by Mugsy
Disco wrote:
22 Oct 2018, 10:35
Mugsy wrote:
22 Oct 2018, 09:50
And this is why everyone needs to have access to more than a few days of carers leave and flex time.
She does, or she should - except she generally takes 1 day of carers leave each fortnight without fail, always with a medical certificate.
Ah, so low on carers leave. What about working from home?

Re: Fleeting/Random/Thoughts

Posted: 22 Oct 2018, 12:22
by Disco
Mugsy wrote:
22 Oct 2018, 12:12


Ah, so low on carers leave. What about working from home?
Isn't something we do, it's generally seen as a way of paying someone 100% of their salary but probably only getting 40% of the work done because they're supposedly caring for their child. Although, we don't do it in general, at all, ever.

I'd say she'll probably be let go for something else at some point, she's just too inconsistent regardless of her reasons.

Re: Fleeting/Random/Thoughts

Posted: 22 Oct 2018, 12:55
by CherryRed
I understand that people, including kids, get sick from time to time but the amount of time this woman has off at Disco's work even pisses me off, and I don't work with her. It's because of people like her that people like Disco's boss don't want to employ someone like me, even if I'd be kick ass capable of doing the job, simply because I have a vagina and may potentially spit a kid out of it one day.

As a parent, if I was needing to take a day off once a fortnight because my child was "ill" I'd be at the GP demanding blood work and all manner of things to find out why the hell my child is sick so often. Sure, kids are germy, but they aren't THAT germy and needing 20-25 days/year carers leave for your sick child is not acceptable.

Re: Fleeting/Random/Thoughts

Posted: 22 Oct 2018, 13:08
by storm84
I read recently that on average kids are sick 7 months of the year. Obviously there are degrees of sick and, but there's definitely a need to look after sick children on a regular basis.

Society doesn't really have a good way to deal with that in the age of both parents working / single parents / etc. Sucks for an employer or co-workers, but there's very little in the way of alternatives. People need to make a living, society needs children to be raised, and illness is a fact of life. All these are incompatible with each other in the modern workforce.

Re: Fleeting/Random/Thoughts

Posted: 22 Oct 2018, 13:16
by CherryRed
Prior to starting school, the average is around 8 illnesses per calendar year (colds, gastro bugs, etc). Once in school that should drop to 3-4 illnesses a year. This is for your average, healthy child without any pre-existing complications.

If my kid was sick for 7 months out of every 12, no way would I accept that as 'normal' nor would I expect any employer to continue to pay me and accept that I will be absent for that amount of time. There comes a point where your need to care for your family is unfair on your employer.

Re: Fleeting/Random/Thoughts

Posted: 22 Oct 2018, 14:05
by Disco
storm84 wrote:
22 Oct 2018, 13:08
I read recently that on average kids are sick 7 months of the year. Obviously there are degrees of sick and, but there's definitely a need to look after sick children on a regular basis.

Society doesn't really have a good way to deal with that in the age of both parents working / single parents / etc. Sucks for an employer or co-workers, but there's very little in the way of alternatives. People need to make a living, society needs children to be raised, and illness is a fact of life. All these are incompatible with each other in the modern workforce.
I think unfortunately the alternative is that we actively wont hire people that potentially will not need to take time off to look after their children :/

Re: Fleeting/Random/Thoughts

Posted: 22 Oct 2018, 15:36
by Mugsy
Disco wrote:
22 Oct 2018, 12:22
Mugsy wrote:
22 Oct 2018, 12:12


Ah, so low on carers leave. What about working from home?
Isn't something we do, it's generally seen as a way of paying someone 100% of their salary but probably only getting 40% of the work done because they're supposedly caring for their child. Although, we don't do it in general, at all, ever.

I'd say she'll probably be let go for something else at some point, she's just too inconsistent regardless of her reasons.
Fair enough. Unless the workplace can set outputs based objectives and move away from % productivity, it's not going to work then.

When I work from home, my boss and I agree to what deliverables is expected from me by the next day. When I get around to it is up to me and it's my responsibility to make sure I contact my stakeholders during office hours. Of course, this doesn't work for every job.

Re: Fleeting/Random/Thoughts

Posted: 22 Oct 2018, 17:00
by DarkMellie
Disco wrote:
22 Oct 2018, 09:19
I'm starting to understand why employers don't want to hire mothers, talk about a pain in the ass.. so much time off work for illness, then, trying to bring her sick kid into the office with her? For fucks sake.
Mums make for great staff members. They have higher tenure, build deeper capability, are more loyal... and yes require extra time here and there. Kids are disgusting disease factories which if you ever have kids you'll find out about. If there's limited or no family support it makes it even harder.

Support her and you'll have a dedicated worker... let on that you're frustrated by her life getting in the way of things and you'll find yourself on the wrong end of a discrimination claim.

Have you talked to her about the episode with bringing the child in? Cherry nails the consequences on that one so would the Mum be aware of that? What other options did she have that day? Has she run out of paid leave (and can your company do anything further to financially support by allowing sick leave payments)?

Re: Fleeting/Random/Thoughts

Posted: 22 Oct 2018, 18:17
by CherryRed
We don't not have children out of choice, I can't have children naturally and we have been fighting for years for a family - so forgive me if that notion that "if you ever have kids you will understand" gets under my skin a bit. Anyway, getting back on track, you don't have to have children yourself to understand that kids get sick a lot but it doesn't take a genius to realise this woman is rorting the system with the sick kid claims knowing full well that she can't be sacked for taking care of her sick child. What Disco hasn't mentioned is that she has her own property management business and there's a relative level of certainty that her child is often "sick" when she has other engagements for her own business.

Re: Fleeting/Random/Thoughts

Posted: 22 Oct 2018, 18:59
by Mugsy
CherryRed wrote:
22 Oct 2018, 18:17
What Disco hasn't mentioned is that she has her own property management business and there's a relative level of certainty that her child is often "sick" when she has other engagements for her own business.
That clears things up easily.

Re: Fleeting/Random/Thoughts

Posted: 22 Oct 2018, 19:46
by kharis
We don’t all take advantage. I only apply for jobs now that aren’t full time or have the option to work from home and allow me to look after the kids. Will hopefully be easier next year when they are both at the same school.

Hell, I spend most of my time working anyway between 2 jobs, making websites (I have a couple on the go at the moment) and a tafe course (as well as sorting out the kids and house)

It’s no wonder I’m tired. I probably should have slept a bit on the weekend instead of binge watching daredevil, oh well :)

Re: Fleeting/Random/Thoughts

Posted: 22 Oct 2018, 20:03
by Disco
No 100% Kharis, but people like this.. ruin it for everyone else :/

Re: Fleeting/Random/Thoughts

Posted: 22 Oct 2018, 20:21
by DarkMellie
CherryRed wrote:
22 Oct 2018, 18:17
We don't not have children out of choice, I can't have children naturally and we have been fighting for years for a family - so forgive me if that notion that "if you ever have kids you will understand" gets under my skin a bit. Anyway, getting back on track, you don't have to have children yourself to understand that kids get sick a lot but it doesn't take a genius to realise this woman is rorting the system with the sick kid claims knowing full well that she can't be sacked for taking care of her sick child. What Disco hasn't mentioned is that she has her own property management business and there's a relative level of certainty that her child is often "sick" when she has other engagements for her own business.
As someone who's opinions and world view changed after having kids, I get that you don't like it but it's true (generally, for most people, probs not for this lady). I'm a pretty empathetic person too, I thought I knew what kids would be like but it's unimaginable. And what I see in my workplace is a lot of leaders/managers who get frustrated with working parents which is the angle I was coming from. If not relevant to you both then please ignore.

Yeah I hear all that and you're probably right... but given it can never be proven, managers aren't doctors and even if you 'catch' her out in the wild it is usually easily defensible... the best advice I can offer (not that I was being asked for it) is to let go of the emotion and supposition around it. Someone who is taking liberties like that is just waiting for the opportunity to get a cash handout and it's easy to skirt too easy to push the envelope in those cases and end up somehow the bad guy.

Re: Fleeting/Random/Thoughts

Posted: 22 Oct 2018, 20:36
by CherryRed
I hope her bludging are gets sacked.

Dont like my opinion? Feel free to ignore that too.

Re: Fleeting/Random/Thoughts

Posted: 22 Oct 2018, 20:48
by DarkMellie
Done.

Re: Fleeting/Random/Thoughts

Posted: 22 Oct 2018, 20:54
by CherryRed
Too easy.

Re: Fleeting/Random/Thoughts

Posted: 23 Oct 2018, 08:32
by Disco
GOOD NEWS EVERYBODY!

My Knuckle Duster footpegs cleared customs!

Re: Fleeting/Random/Thoughts

Posted: 23 Oct 2018, 20:10
by Otto-matic Reiffel
Just noticed that I've paid off the last of my HECS debt. Wooo :clap:

Re: Fleeting/Random/Thoughts

Posted: 23 Oct 2018, 20:43
by Nitephyre
Disco wrote:
23 Oct 2018, 08:32
GOOD NEWS EVERYBODY!

My Knuckle Duster footpegs cleared customs!
Hah, I was expecting you to get a Please Explain! :clap:

Re: Fleeting/Random/Thoughts

Posted: 23 Oct 2018, 20:50
by storm84
Otto-matic Reiffel wrote:
23 Oct 2018, 20:10
Just noticed that I've paid off the last of my HECS debt. Wooo :clap:
Always good when that happens. It was nice when I realised that it was gone when i got a sizeable tax return, and even better when I stopped repayments coming out of my salary.

Re: Fleeting/Random/Thoughts

Posted: 23 Oct 2018, 21:19
by Mugsy
storm84 wrote:
23 Oct 2018, 20:50
Otto-matic Reiffel wrote:
23 Oct 2018, 20:10
Just noticed that I've paid off the last of my HECS debt. Wooo :clap:
Always good when that happens. It was nice when I realised that it was gone when i got a sizeable tax return, and even better when I stopped repayments coming out of my salary.
I remember when I paid off my HECS debt. The workplace I was at fucked up and didn't take out any HECS from my pay for the portion of that year I was with the company (about 7 months) so when it came tax return time, the ATO had applied their CPI index and I lost another $400 more than what my HECS should have cost me.

I keep getting told the private sector is more efficient... from my experiences, all I see are examples of fuck ups where lack of checks have just resulted in me losing out where I shouldn't have. I know this isn't indication of the entire private sector... but I'm just more happy in the public sector. Happy to navigate the red tape but know there's systems and processes in place to protect me.

Anyway, well done Otto for reaching a key milestone. Be sure to inform the workplace (I think it's the workplace) that your HECS is paid off else, from memory, they will keep paying and you won't get that overpayment back till your next tax return. That reminds me I gotta chase up on my own tax return.

Re: Fleeting/Random/Thoughts

Posted: 23 Oct 2018, 22:27
by Mythor
Woohoo, congrats Otto!

Re: Fleeting/Random/Thoughts

Posted: 24 Oct 2018, 07:14
by CherryRed
That was the shittiest nights sleep I've had in quite some time