What I hate most about the state of AAA gaming

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Spooler
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What I hate most about the state of AAA gaming

Post by Spooler » 08 Dec 2015, 15:37

People claim to hate many things about the current state of the industry "there's not enough innovation", "there's too many pixels these days" "there's not enough strong female characters".

For me though it's DLC, specifically DLC where it feels like half the game is missing.

The following is how I feel my consumer relationship with AAA studios goes.

"Hey I'm That AAA Studio, I've got this totally awesome game releasing today it's a new IP and it has unicorns and lasers and all that cool stuff!"
That sounds great, how do I get a hold of it ?


"Give us $100 and you can play our game."
Ok sounds fair here's $100.

"O by the way you're going to want this season pass to get all the content."
O, is that like some sort of expansion pre order ?

"Sure it is ! Except we don't guarantee the quality or amount of content you're going to get but trust us you'll love whatever it is we throw together !" Uhuh I guess that money would just get spent on beer anyways and I have enjoyed the core game-play sure here have another $50.

"Cool here have 1 map and some new weapon skins."
Ok that's cool, how much more DLC is coming ?

"We have another 3 maps lined up for you !"
Ok, then what ?

"Nothing we're done with this game now. By the way we're having a sale on for it once the last DLC comes out the game and all the DLC for $15 ! But if you want more, here pre order the sequel to this game you'll love that and it's only $120 with the season pass included !"
Hmm, so once you've finished all the DLC for This game the sequel will you be having a sale on with it and all the DLC super cheap ?

"Yes probably..."
Ok so I can just wait for you to develop the entire thing pay less and have a complete bug free experience ?

"Yes you could totally do that but there's pre order only content that's totally exclusive"
So I either pay for an incomplete product or don't get a piece of it ?

"Yes"
Ok ... I'm going to hang out with the indie developer's now.


Call me nostalgic but I miss the simpler times of complete games, content patches and expansion packs.
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Re: What I hate most about the state of AAA gaming

Post by Artful-dodgeR » 08 Dec 2015, 16:05

Very much have that feeling. I'm leaning toward either F2P or simpler games these days... or just waiting on the bargain bin 2 years after the game is released.
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Re: What I hate most about the state of AAA gaming

Post by Dexterians » 08 Dec 2015, 16:11

I haven't read the OP, but what I hate about AAA gaming these days is that it seems we pay for BETA's or DEMO's and in order to get the full version of the game, we must pay additionally for a Season Pass in order to unlock our full game.


EDIT: just read the OP, seems we have the same gripe lol.
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Re: What I hate most about the state of AAA gaming

Post by n1cholas » 08 Dec 2015, 16:36

It all comes back to voting with your wallet as you have done when it comes to Star Wars Battlefront.

I do not own a PS4 or Xbox One and my PC (3570k/GTX670/8GB RAM) is becoming dated, the lousy business practices of publishers has in part has made it easy to pass on the PS4 and Xbox One thus far.

There are so many good release and upcoming games for prior console generations and PC that I've no shortage of games to play.

I am not wowed by graphics like I was when I was younger, graphics even on small budget games are generally acceptable now.

I'd much rather a game be an enjoyable good value for money package than a graphically impressive game lacking content.

I prefer balanced arena style shooters like Quake 3 Arena and Halo CE. 2 and 3. Most modern shooters use the design book of COD (accessible and shallow gameplay, diminished significance of geometry and map design, lacking good game design and balance).
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Re: What I hate most about the state of AAA gaming

Post by SuBw00FeR » 08 Dec 2015, 17:01

Blizzard and Valve man, only good gaming companies left. They have some hiccups for sure, but it's nothing like the other developers.

Overwatch was just announced that all future Heroes and Maps will be Free for everyone. They don't wanna segregate the community.
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Re: What I hate most about the state of AAA gaming

Post by Spooler » 08 Dec 2015, 17:05

SuBw00FeR wrote:Blizzard and Valve man, only good gaming companies left. They have some hiccups for sure, but it's nothing like the other developers.

Overwatch was just announced that all future Heroes and Maps will be Free for everyone. They don't wanna segregate the community.

I'm not overly happy with Blizzard right now asking me for $21 for nova missions when I've already bought 3 full retail price games to finish the dammed story off and now there's even more cost for me to access the rest of it ? Total screw over there imo.

And valve ... they don't even really make games anymore do they ? their last outing was DOTA and that was how long ago now ?
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Re: What I hate most about the state of AAA gaming

Post by kittycatArcane » 08 Dec 2015, 17:29

Generally, the state of AAA gaming seems to be focused more on "LOOK AT ALL THE SHINY STUFF WE CAN DO" than actually making it fun AND functional AND doing some cool new stuff.
A lot of it breaks down to simple greed.
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Re: What I hate most about the state of AAA gaming

Post by Ralph Wiggum » 08 Dec 2015, 18:10

Not specifically targetted at you but I follow this method:

Don't pre-order. Wait for reviews and player feedback.

If I feel like ignoring the above, then I pay as much for a game that I think it's worth. Or as much that I'm willing to write off as a bad purchase.

And I keep chugging along quite happily.
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Re: What I hate most about the state of AAA gaming

Post by Stoibs » 08 Dec 2015, 18:22

Waiting for the whole product really is the way to go these days, I picked up quite a few bargains during the recent Black Friday/Cyber Monday weekend (FarCry 4 Gold, Black Flag+Season Pass, Evil Within Complete etc.) for $5~$15 a pop. And I learned this same annoyance for Telltale's games aswell the hard way (Tales from the Borderlands and Game Of Thrones were all the more sweeter at the $5 each I paid when they were much closer to their finale's a year later)

Having a few thousand large Steam backlog and/or a few online 'core' games to go back to and kill time with indefinitely while you wait for the more reasonably priced everything editions is my gaming 101 these days. As an added bonus you get the fixes and mods done by the time you get around to these AAA's (I already see there's frequent optimization patches and an actual proper written dialogue mod for Fallout 4 thankfully, I wonder what other additions and fan-made betterments will be available by the time I grab this for a fiver 2yrs from now), and at this time of year when the GOTY awards are out you can see what really is worth taking a look at ('Spose I should take another look at and put Witcher 3 back on my wishlist since it did win some RPG of the year awards, for instance)

Agree with the whole 'AAA devs seem to think that all we want is graphics' sentiment and how much better and unshackled a lot of Indie games really are by comparison more-so these days too. I find myself looking into these from my backlog (dem indie bundles..) and for 2016's upcoming releases with more excitement after discovering and finding many hidden gems that surpass the 'big-hitters' as of late. Goes hand in hand with my personal 2015 GOTY being something I kickstarted to boot.
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Re: What I hate most about the state of AAA gaming

Post by Matty » 08 Dec 2015, 18:41

I also follow the wait till it's out or pre-order if I support the company rule like Ralph.
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Re: What I hate most about the state of AAA gaming

Post by n1cholas » 08 Dec 2015, 19:28

SuBw00FeR wrote:Blizzard and Valve man, only good gaming companies left. They have some hiccups for sure, but it's nothing like the other developers.
After experiencing Diablo III my opinion of Blizzard dropped a lot.

Diablo is the only Blizzard franchise I had much love for and Diablo III killed that, I've been back and played Diablo III occasionally and I just don't enjoy the game.
SuBw00FeR wrote:Overwatch was just announced that all future Heroes and Maps will be Free for everyone. They don't wanna segregate the community.
It's less of an issue on PC but segregating the community with DLC kills Aussie communities very fast on consoles as often said games on consoles don't have large Aussie communities and/or lack staying power.
kittycatArcane wrote:Generally, the state of AAA gaming seems to be focused more on "LOOK AT ALL THE SHINY STUFF WE CAN DO" than actually making it fun AND functional AND doing some cool new stuff.
A lot of it breaks down to simple greed.
I don't watch gaming stocks but I wonder how gaming stocks are doing.

I assume Activision's stocks have gone down with Call of Duty and World of Warcraft sales declining but I honestly don't know.
Ralph Wiggum wrote:Don't pre-order. Wait for reviews and player feedback.
I've always done that.

That sentence reminded of when I bought a launch Xbox 360 $650 with Oblivion for $80 pricematched, the guy standing next to me overheard the price and asked the EB staff if he could get Oblivion for $80 too, the EB staff explained that he had pre-ordered Oblivion for $109.95 and while he had only downpayed $10 he would have to pay $109.95 so he cancelled the pre-order on Oblivion and lost $10 but got the EB staff to match $80.

Actively avoided EB Games after that and other misleading nonsense I saw them say to uninformed customers but the EB two year extended Xbox 360 warranty I purchased was a god send during the RRoD years.

I'm not sure I could fairly classify it as a AAA game since I bought Payday 2 and all it's content save for the historic weapon pack on 75% off specials on Steam but it really sucked when they introduced microtransactions and "adjusted" the game accordingly. They seem to have changed their tune but I doubt the Payday 2 community will fully recover.
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Re: What I hate most about the state of AAA gaming

Post by Dexterians » 08 Dec 2015, 20:59

I'd understand if these AAA companies gave us a COMPLETE game experience and charged us for DLC to expand on that content, but instead they give us minimum and want us to pay for the complete experience. It's frustrating as all hell.

I think there should be free ways to unlock DLC, giving gamers the option to grind to unlock or pay now to unlock now.. similar to how most of the content in PlanetSide 2 works.
Ralph Wiggum wrote:Don't pre-order. Wait for reviews and player feedback.
Generally this is my approach, or I'll pre-order and wait a few days to see what feedback is like before picking up my collectors edition. Depends on the game and how much I want said game.
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Re: What I hate most about the state of AAA gaming

Post by Spooler » 08 Dec 2015, 21:20

Ralph Wiggum wrote:Not specifically targetted at you but I follow this method:

Don't pre-order. Wait for reviews and player feedback.

If I feel like ignoring the above, then I pay as much for a game that I think it's worth. Or as much that I'm willing to write off as a bad purchase.

And I keep chugging along quite happily.

This is pretty much my approach. Usually I decide the game will only be worth it when it's in the bargain bin
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Re: What I hate most about the state of AAA gaming

Post by Nacimota » 08 Dec 2015, 23:04

Spooler wrote:And valve ... they don't even really make games anymore do they ? their last outing was DOTA and that was how long ago now ?
Two years, which is not that long tbh.
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Re: What I hate most about the state of AAA gaming

Post by Spooler » 08 Dec 2015, 23:30

Eh it was out long before it was "officially" released. Also 2 years is a long time to be completely silent on whether or not you actually have something in development or not.
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Re: What I hate most about the state of AAA gaming

Post by Otto-matic Reiffel » 09 Dec 2015, 00:14

At this point do Valve even need to make games? Steam would be earning them far more money than an all-our-hopes-and-dreams-came-true Half Life 3.

As for AAA, I generally don't pre-order any more (apart from a free AC:S). Closest I got was Just Cause 3, but the whole pre-order bonuses shit me. DLC is sitting not too far behind that to the point that I don't buy games that just about require DLC to keep playing with Battlefield etc being a good example of this.
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Re: What I hate most about the state of AAA gaming

Post by Nacimota » 09 Dec 2015, 00:43

Spooler wrote:Eh it was out long before it was "officially" released.
I don't really see how that is relevant. The bottom line is the game was in active development (and still is, in fact), so it strikes me as disingenuous to say that Valve doesn't make games anymore.
Spooler wrote:Also 2 years is a long time to be completely silent on whether or not you actually have something in development or not.
I disagree. It's extremely common in the industry for projects to be in development for years before being announced publically.
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Re: What I hate most about the state of AAA gaming

Post by Artful-dodgeR » 09 Dec 2015, 08:24

Maybe you guys are forgetting that valve only released Source 2 engine this year...
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Re: What I hate most about the state of AAA gaming

Post by Makena » 09 Dec 2015, 08:44

I play games that are fun, and don't play games that aren't.

I know that's a super complex scenario, but somehow I make it work.
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Re: What I hate most about the state of AAA gaming

Post by Disruptor4 » 09 Dec 2015, 09:11

Makena wrote:I play games that are fun, and don't play games that aren't.

I know that's a super complex scenario, but somehow I make it work.
This.
Otto-matic Reiffel wrote:As for AAA, I generally don't pre-order any more (apart from a free AC:S). Closest I got was Just Cause 3, but the whole pre-order bonuses shit me. DLC is sitting not too far behind that to the point that I don't buy games that just about require DLC to keep playing with Battlefield etc being a good example of this.
I really don't think Battlefield is a good example as you don't need the premium to experience a full enough game. The Premium just adds a whole lot more which is worth the money, imo. I bought BF4 + Premium about a year after release for a total of $100. Not bad for the amount of time and fun I've had. I could probably still jump on and have a boat load of fun, and they're still adding content.
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Re: What I hate most about the state of AAA gaming

Post by Spooler » 09 Dec 2015, 12:29

Nacimota wrote:
Spooler wrote:Eh it was out long before it was "officially" released.
I don't really see how that is relevant. The bottom line is the game was in active development (and still is, in fact), so it strikes me as disingenuous to say that Valve doesn't make games anymore.
Spooler wrote:Also 2 years is a long time to be completely silent on whether or not you actually have something in development or not.
I disagree. It's extremely common in the industry for projects to be in development for years before being announced publically.

I didn't say they don't make games any-more although in my mind they haven't really made anything since Portal 2 as everything else they've done has just been a re release of an existing game CS:GO is no different from source minus a graphics upgrade and a few minor tweaks and the same for DOTA 2 it's functionally no different from DOTA the war craft mod minus a few balance tweaks etc. Having said that they're not really relevant to AAA gaming right now if they start announcing retail games again then that'll chance but at the moment .
The last thing they released was a Free to play remake of a mod.

At present they have nothing even announced so for 2016 at-least they're still going to remain irrelevant to the current state of AAA releases.

Makena wrote:I play games that are fun, and don't play games that aren't.

I know that's a super complex scenario, but somehow I make it work.
I think everyone does this, but there's still a problem when even if you enjoy an experience it feels incomplete at release and you're already being asked for further investment in the hopes that the content being pre-sold to you sight unseen will make it feel more like a complete experience.

I can really enjoy a game and still feel like I've been completely ripped off/deceived/misled/treated poorly by the developer by how it was marketed and sold to me. Diablo 3 is actually an example of this, to get any enjoyment out of it I had to buy reaper of souls a fact that to this day has left abit of a sour impression of present day blizzard with me.

Artful-dodgeR wrote:Maybe you guys are forgetting that valve only released Source 2 engine this year...
It's not about whether they're developing new technologies or not, it's about how AAA studios/publishers market and sell games at present. Something Valve hasn't done in years and even their last release was a free to play so it's not really relevant to retail release AAA discussions as you can't really talk about cutting content off from a player and forcing them to pay for it if you're giving them everything for free.

Although maybe seeing Free to play as an automatic dis qualifier for being AAA is just a perception issue from my point of view /shrugs.
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Re: What I hate most about the state of AAA gaming

Post by Makena » 09 Dec 2015, 13:00

Spooler wrote:I can really enjoy a game and still feel like I've been completely ripped off/deceived/misled/treated poorly by the developer by how it was marketed and sold to me. Diablo 3 is actually an example of this, to get any enjoyment out of it I had to buy reaper of souls a fact that to this day has left abit of a sour impression of present day blizzard with me.
I played Vanilla D3 for 150 hours or something. So while I was disappointed in what it was, I still enjoyed it.

EDIT: not to dismiss your problems, but if you didn't enjoy D3, then ok, it's a game you didn't enjoy. I've played a number of games I didn't enjoy, I just don't find it offensive that a developer/publisher released a game I didn't enjoy.
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Re: What I hate most about the state of AAA gaming

Post by Otto-matic Reiffel » 09 Dec 2015, 13:05

Disruptor4 wrote: I really don't think Battlefield is a good example as you don't need the premium to experience a full enough game. The Premium just adds a whole lot more which is worth the money, imo. I bought BF4 + Premium about a year after release for a total of $100. Not bad for the amount of time and fun I've had. I could probably still jump on and have a boat load of fun, and they're still adding content.
I guess it really depends on what you consider "full enough" and what is DLC. Premium is the same as a Season Pass, ie it's a DLC pack. I purchased Battlefield 3 Limited Edition soon after release. Immediately there was a divide where a few people couldn't get into some games due to not having the limited edition. Then when the newer DLCs came out it was a choice of 24/7 Metro or purchasing the DLCs/Premium. I don't think I really got that great a value out of it.

Never mind that a game shouldn't cost $100 anyway a full year after release. Most AAA games have dropped to $40 at that point if you don't shop at EB.
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Re: What I hate most about the state of AAA gaming

Post by Disruptor4 » 09 Dec 2015, 13:19

Spooler wrote:Although maybe seeing Free to play as an automatic dis qualifier for being AAA is just a perception issue from my point of view /shrugs.
I'd say it is definitely a perception issue from your point of view, because simply put, just because it's free to play, doesn't mean it's not a AAA game.
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Re: What I hate most about the state of AAA gaming

Post by storm84 » 09 Dec 2015, 13:43

I really don't mind DLC - when it's cosmetic I ignore it, and when it doesn't add anything to the game, I don't buy it. It's like what expansions did in the past.

My main gripe with AAA gaming is how much of what's coming out resembles what's already out. The industry is kind of blending everything, and there's a standard generic experience now. It's hard to get excited about anything.

That and QTEs. Fuck QTEs!
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